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Pac-12's mediocrity on full display

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Re: Pac-12's mediocrity on full display

Postby Xenon » February 13th, 2020, 9:41 am

I can't get to the whole article, so maybe there is some good news at the end of the article but .....

https://theathletic.com/1604854/2020/02 ... gan-state/

Folks, I’m here today to officially recant my previous position on a certain topic.

Last year, as Pac-12 fans increasingly made known their collective angst over the conference’s football struggles, I tried to assure them that the league will eventually rebound. “Call me crazy, but my guess is sometime in the next five years, a roster of coaches that includes (Chris) Petersen, (David) Shaw, (Chip) Kelly, Mike Leach and … maybe Urban Meyer? … will figure this thing out at some point,” I wrote last May.

As you may have noticed, Petersen and Leach are no longer in the conference. Kelly has thus far been a dud at UCLA, Shaw is coming off the worst season of his Stanford tenure and Clay Helton, not Urban Meyer, remains the coach of USC.

More regrettably: “I don’t share the same degree of panic about the impact of (the Pac-12’s) revenue gap. … Money is not near the top of the list of reasons why Pac-12 teams are struggling in...


I’m no longer confident the Conference of Champions is going to rise back up into a regular CFP participant in short order. The coaching lineup is underwhelming. The recruiting is alarming. And now, I finally share their fans’ panic over the mounting revenue gap between the Pac-12 and the Big Ten/SEC.


It's NOT just a question of "get better coaches" ... since they had what certainly looked like great coaches and that didn't help ... and now they are losing those great coaches.

It's NOT just a question of "do better recruiting" ... since they are losing recruits to the SEC in particular, but also to the BigTen and BigXII.

There is something structurally wrong in the PAC-12 .... and that is not going to just get better....

It's not going to get better in 2020 ... and probably not until there are pretty major changes in the PAC-12.... but those might be tooooo late.

I don't think 5 Power Conferences is stable long term when you have structurally 4 slots for the CFP .... So somehow things are going to settle to 4 Power Conferences eventually. BigEast I'm sure thought they were going to be a Power Conference in Football ... until suddenly they don't even exist in Football any more. The next big round of re-alignment is probably a few years away, but the patterns that are going to dominate that new re-alignment are being set RIGHT NOW ....

If the BigXII offered USC the same deal as Texas has right now ... do you think USC might jump?

You can say I'm just a PAC-12 hater ... but that doesn't change that the PAC-12 is struggling ... others see it too....

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Re: Pac-12's mediocrity on full display

Postby MikeTheTiger » February 13th, 2020, 9:58 am

Xenon wrote:It's NOT just a question of "get better coaches" ... since they had what certainly looked like great coaches and that didn't help ... and now they are losing those great coaches.

It's NOT just a question of "do better recruiting" ... since they are losing recruits to the SEC in particular, but also to the BigTen and BigXII.

There is something structurally wrong in the PAC-12 .... and that is not going to just get better....

It's not going to get better in 2020 ... and probably not until there are pretty major changes in the PAC-12.... but those might be tooooo late.

I don't think 5 Power Conferences is stable long term when you have structurally 4 slots for the CFP .... So somehow things are going to settle to 4 Power Conferences eventually. BigEast I'm sure thought they were going to be a Power Conference in Football ... until suddenly they don't even exist in Football any more. The next big round of re-alignment is probably a few years away, but the patterns that are going to dominate that new re-alignment are being set RIGHT NOW ....

If the BigXII offered USC the same deal as Texas has right now ... do you think USC might jump?

You can say I'm just a PAC-12 hater ... but that doesn't change that the PAC-12 is struggling ... others see it too....


The problem for the Pac-12 is as much perception as it is overall competitiveness. The biggest issue is that perception is so focused on the top strength of each conference rather than overall competitiveness. The Pac-12 did not have a lot of high profile wins this past season, but they did have their fair share of mid-level wins. In reality, the Pac-12 performed better than both the Big 12 and ACC this season, but they are perceived to be worse because they do not have a program on the level of Clemson or Oklahoma right now. The SEC has an ability to cycle through top programs from year-to-year (Alabama, Georgia, LSU, Auburn, Florida) that the other conferences just can't match. The Big 10 is just as dependent on Ohio St to be that standard bearer as the Big 12 and ACC are on Oklahoma and Clemson. The problem for the Pac-12 is that no one is stepping forward to fill that role. Otherwise, overall conference strength has been better than the Big 12 and ACC and really not that far behind the Big 10 as evidenced by the Oregon-Wisconsin, Arizona St-Michigan St, and Cal-Illinois results.

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Re: Pac-12's mediocrity on full display

Postby Dubby » February 14th, 2020, 11:44 am

MikeTheTiger wrote:
Xenon wrote:It's NOT just a question of "get better coaches" ... since they had what certainly looked like great coaches and that didn't help ... and now they are losing those great coaches.

It's NOT just a question of "do better recruiting" ... since they are losing recruits to the SEC in particular, but also to the BigTen and BigXII.

There is something structurally wrong in the PAC-12 .... and that is not going to just get better....

It's not going to get better in 2020 ... and probably not until there are pretty major changes in the PAC-12.... but those might be tooooo late.

I don't think 5 Power Conferences is stable long term when you have structurally 4 slots for the CFP .... So somehow things are going to settle to 4 Power Conferences eventually. BigEast I'm sure thought they were going to be a Power Conference in Football ... until suddenly they don't even exist in Football any more. The next big round of re-alignment is probably a few years away, but the patterns that are going to dominate that new re-alignment are being set RIGHT NOW ....

If the BigXII offered USC the same deal as Texas has right now ... do you think USC might jump?

You can say I'm just a PAC-12 hater ... but that doesn't change that the PAC-12 is struggling ... others see it too....


The problem for the Pac-12 is as much perception as it is overall competitiveness. The biggest issue is that perception is so focused on the top strength of each conference rather than overall competitiveness. The Pac-12 did not have a lot of high profile wins this past season, but they did have their fair share of mid-level wins. In reality, the Pac-12 performed better than both the Big 12 and ACC this season, but they are perceived to be worse because they do not have a program on the level of Clemson or Oklahoma right now. The SEC has an ability to cycle through top programs from year-to-year (Alabama, Georgia, LSU, Auburn, Florida) that the other conferences just can't match. The Big 10 is just as dependent on Ohio St to be that standard bearer as the Big 12 and ACC are on Oklahoma and Clemson. The problem for the Pac-12 is that no one is stepping forward to fill that role. Otherwise, overall conference strength has been better than the Big 12 and ACC and really not that far behind the Big 10 as evidenced by the Oregon-Wisconsin, Arizona St-Michigan St, and Cal-Illinois results.


Agreed with with MTT

Let me also add USC is not going anywhere and their adm said that years ago and still say that today

The article posted is perception view and not on field view

CFP is being dominated by few teams Clemson, Alabama, Oklahoma & Ohio St

Its not being dominated by anyone one conference

Even B10 miss prior 2 years until tOhio St made it back this season

B10 3
PAC 12 (2) Oregon loss to tOhio St 2014/2015

B10 its Been tOhio St U 2 and Sparty 1

Why our we giving the B10 pass?

Just because TOSU made it the past Season

The PAC 12 needs that one team to rise and challenge and maintain it like the ones I named have been doing since CFP

But, unfair to PAC12 is struggling when its basically 4 teams dominating the CFP
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